Monday
Nov102008
No Sinners in My House
Monday, November 10, 2008
We have made a careful and important decision to raise our children without religion. There are many many reasons for this, but I want to focus on one of them in my post today: sin. According to All About God:
Christian teachings talk about the seven deadly sins (lust, gluttony, greed, sloth, wrath, envy and pride), the Ten Commandments (which you must follow or you have sinned) and other sins that come out of the apparent word of God (e.g. homosexuality).
I reject the concept of sin and I will not teach my children about sin. Here is why...
I mentioned in another post that I am reading Parenting Beyond Belief. I generally read one essay each time my kids are in the bath. I get to do a bit of reading while keeping an eye on them as they play in the bubbles. The essay that I was reading yesterday by Dan Barker talked about the pessimistic view of human nature that many religions have:
I will not teach my children that we are all sinners. I will teach them that people are generally good. That they want to be nice and do nice things. That they will help you if you ask. If my kids see this as the rule and see not so nice behaviour as the exception, then hopefully peer pressure will help turn them into good people. I want them to think it is natural to be nice to others.
The problem with the concept of sin, which is one that is used in many religions, is that each religion has its own list of sins and while there are some common veins across all of them, there are also huge differences. I certainly have values that I want to pass on to my children, but I want them to understand that those are my values, those are not THE right values. Other people believe other things and value other things and that is fine. I would be okay with other people talking about sin if they only applied it to their own lives and didn't project it onto others.
When one person or group of people project their values onto others and tell them that they are right or wrong as a result, or even worse, they are going to hell, I think that creates a dysfunctional society and is what leads to some of the horrid wars we have seen over the years.
Let me tell you the story of Mikey's lunch. Mikey was a 6 year old kid at a day camp that I worked at. Most of the kids there were Jewish, but it was not a religious camp. Mikey was of italian descent and came to camp one day with a slice of pepperoni pizza. One of the boys in his group saw his pizza and told him he couldn't eat it because it wasn't kosher. He brushed it off, until another and yet another little boy in the group chimed in and agreed. And then they came up with lots of grand ideas about what would happen to him if he ate that piece of pizza, no doubt things mentioned to them by their parents or religious leaders. So Mikey cried and cried. He cried because he was hungry. He cried because he was embarrassed. He cried because he didn't understand why his mother wanted to poison him. But there was nothing wrong with Mikey's pizza. Mikey was Catholic, so he can eat pepperoni pizza.
Personally, I reject many of the things that Christians call sins. I think pride in your own accomplishments is important. I believe that sexual orientation is defined by nature and that some people are heterosexual, some are homosexual and some are somewhere in between and none of them are better than the other. I enjoy being slothful sometimes and don't feel guilty about it. I think white lies are fine in some circumstances and just part of common courtesy. I covet, yes I covet, and it helps motivate me! My values are different from the values that many Christians or Jews or Muslims have chosen. I'm okay with that as long as they don't tell me or anyone else that they are wrong for being different.
We're all different, and that's okay.
In the same essay I quoted above, Barker goes on to explain that it is better to tell children that they are okay the way they are. This is a concept that is emphasized over and over again in Alfie Kohn's Unconditional Parenting. He explains that children need to know that they will be accepted even if they screw up or fall short. I know that Christians say that God loves everyone unconditionally, but when he calls them "sinners" it is certainly a different message that gets conveyed. Kohn explains in his book that if you tell your child that you love him unconditionally, but then tell him he is bad for doing X, Y or Z, you are sending a mixed message.
Sure, there are consequences of poor decisions. And we need to live with those consequences. As Warren Buffet said: "It takes 20 years to build a reputation & five minutes to ruin it. If you think about that, you'll do things differently." This is what I want my children to think about when making decisions, not the threat of going to hell if they make a bad choice and also not the idea that they can make that bad decision go away by looking for salvation. There are real consequences in real life and we need to live with those.
I also know that sometimes good things come out of decisions that can be considered sins. Committing adultery is detrimental to a relationship. The consequence is that people can get hurt and the marriage may split up. However, I don't think it makes someone a bad person and sometimes good things come out of adultery. I was struck by this when listening to Kellylee Evans speak on the CBC on Ottawa Morning on November 7. She mentioned that she and her brother are 3 months apart in age, that they are from different mothers because her father was "bad". She says that she explores the concepts of good and bad a lot on her new CD ("Good Girl") that is being released early next year because good things sometimes come out of bad things and she wouldn't have been born if her father wasn't "bad". Anyone that has listened to her music cannot deny that she is a good thing.
I respect everyone's right to pass on the values that they think are important to their children. But as soon as they start saying that something is bad or sinful for everyone, versus just being wrong for their family, then I think this starts to create barriers.
So if I'm not going to teach my children about sin, what am I going to do? Here I'll quote another essay from Parenting Beyond Belief, this time by Emily Rosa:
I think this makes more sense than expecting them to be guided by a list of rules that was created a very long time ago. I mean if I was going to create such a list, I would at least update it from time to time. Shouldn't it be a sin not to recycle or to waste energy, for example? Okay, so maybe an abstract interpretation of the seven deadly sins could be applied there, but really I'd rather my kids act out of logical reasoning rather than following a list of rules.
I also want my children to be open and tolerant. I want them to embrace peoples' differences. I want them to get to know people from different cultures, different religions, different sexual orientations, different socio-economic groups, and and son on. And I don't want my children to pass judgment on the others or to have judgment passed on them.
Finally, I want my children to act out of love. I want them to be empathetic towards others. I want them to treat people well because they care about those people and do not want to hurt them, not because they are commanded to do onto others as you would have them do onto you.
A definition of sin is doing what is wrong or not doing what is right according to God's rules (1 John 3:4). If God says "Do not lie" and you lie, then you have sinned. If God says "Do not steal" and you steal, then you have sinned. According to God, sin separates you from Him (Isaiah 59:2).
Christian teachings talk about the seven deadly sins (lust, gluttony, greed, sloth, wrath, envy and pride), the Ten Commandments (which you must follow or you have sinned) and other sins that come out of the apparent word of God (e.g. homosexuality).
I reject the concept of sin and I will not teach my children about sin. Here is why...
I want my children to have a positive view of human nature
I mentioned in another post that I am reading Parenting Beyond Belief. I generally read one essay each time my kids are in the bath. I get to do a bit of reading while keeping an eye on them as they play in the bubbles. The essay that I was reading yesterday by Dan Barker talked about the pessimistic view of human nature that many religions have:
If you teach a generation of children that they are sinful creatures by nature, that left on their own they are morally corrupt, deserving of eternal torment in Hell, that they are not to be trusted to think their own (selfish, evil) thoughts, all of this can become - has become - a self-fulfilling prophecy. Whole segments of hte population grow up with a negative self-image, thinking they really area rotten, in need of a savior or father figure. They are told they are "bad", so they act like it.
I will not teach my children that we are all sinners. I will teach them that people are generally good. That they want to be nice and do nice things. That they will help you if you ask. If my kids see this as the rule and see not so nice behaviour as the exception, then hopefully peer pressure will help turn them into good people. I want them to think it is natural to be nice to others.
I want my children to understand that people are different and that's okay
The problem with the concept of sin, which is one that is used in many religions, is that each religion has its own list of sins and while there are some common veins across all of them, there are also huge differences. I certainly have values that I want to pass on to my children, but I want them to understand that those are my values, those are not THE right values. Other people believe other things and value other things and that is fine. I would be okay with other people talking about sin if they only applied it to their own lives and didn't project it onto others.
When one person or group of people project their values onto others and tell them that they are right or wrong as a result, or even worse, they are going to hell, I think that creates a dysfunctional society and is what leads to some of the horrid wars we have seen over the years.
Let me tell you the story of Mikey's lunch. Mikey was a 6 year old kid at a day camp that I worked at. Most of the kids there were Jewish, but it was not a religious camp. Mikey was of italian descent and came to camp one day with a slice of pepperoni pizza. One of the boys in his group saw his pizza and told him he couldn't eat it because it wasn't kosher. He brushed it off, until another and yet another little boy in the group chimed in and agreed. And then they came up with lots of grand ideas about what would happen to him if he ate that piece of pizza, no doubt things mentioned to them by their parents or religious leaders. So Mikey cried and cried. He cried because he was hungry. He cried because he was embarrassed. He cried because he didn't understand why his mother wanted to poison him. But there was nothing wrong with Mikey's pizza. Mikey was Catholic, so he can eat pepperoni pizza.
Personally, I reject many of the things that Christians call sins. I think pride in your own accomplishments is important. I believe that sexual orientation is defined by nature and that some people are heterosexual, some are homosexual and some are somewhere in between and none of them are better than the other. I enjoy being slothful sometimes and don't feel guilty about it. I think white lies are fine in some circumstances and just part of common courtesy. I covet, yes I covet, and it helps motivate me! My values are different from the values that many Christians or Jews or Muslims have chosen. I'm okay with that as long as they don't tell me or anyone else that they are wrong for being different.
We're all different, and that's okay.
I want my children to understand that making a poor decision does not make you a bad person
In the same essay I quoted above, Barker goes on to explain that it is better to tell children that they are okay the way they are. This is a concept that is emphasized over and over again in Alfie Kohn's Unconditional Parenting. He explains that children need to know that they will be accepted even if they screw up or fall short. I know that Christians say that God loves everyone unconditionally, but when he calls them "sinners" it is certainly a different message that gets conveyed. Kohn explains in his book that if you tell your child that you love him unconditionally, but then tell him he is bad for doing X, Y or Z, you are sending a mixed message.
Sure, there are consequences of poor decisions. And we need to live with those consequences. As Warren Buffet said: "It takes 20 years to build a reputation & five minutes to ruin it. If you think about that, you'll do things differently." This is what I want my children to think about when making decisions, not the threat of going to hell if they make a bad choice and also not the idea that they can make that bad decision go away by looking for salvation. There are real consequences in real life and we need to live with those.
I also know that sometimes good things come out of decisions that can be considered sins. Committing adultery is detrimental to a relationship. The consequence is that people can get hurt and the marriage may split up. However, I don't think it makes someone a bad person and sometimes good things come out of adultery. I was struck by this when listening to Kellylee Evans speak on the CBC on Ottawa Morning on November 7. She mentioned that she and her brother are 3 months apart in age, that they are from different mothers because her father was "bad". She says that she explores the concepts of good and bad a lot on her new CD ("Good Girl") that is being released early next year because good things sometimes come out of bad things and she wouldn't have been born if her father wasn't "bad". Anyone that has listened to her music cannot deny that she is a good thing.
I respect everyone's right to pass on the values that they think are important to their children. But as soon as they start saying that something is bad or sinful for everyone, versus just being wrong for their family, then I think this starts to create barriers.
I want my children's decisions to be guided by reason, openness, and love, not a dictated closed set of values
So if I'm not going to teach my children about sin, what am I going to do? Here I'll quote another essay from Parenting Beyond Belief, this time by Emily Rosa:
Along with the usual secular values (such as appropriate tolerance/intolerance, morality, critical thinking, appreciation for reason and science), don't forget to impart social graces, playfulness and humor.
I think this makes more sense than expecting them to be guided by a list of rules that was created a very long time ago. I mean if I was going to create such a list, I would at least update it from time to time. Shouldn't it be a sin not to recycle or to waste energy, for example? Okay, so maybe an abstract interpretation of the seven deadly sins could be applied there, but really I'd rather my kids act out of logical reasoning rather than following a list of rules.
I also want my children to be open and tolerant. I want them to embrace peoples' differences. I want them to get to know people from different cultures, different religions, different sexual orientations, different socio-economic groups, and and son on. And I don't want my children to pass judgment on the others or to have judgment passed on them.
Finally, I want my children to act out of love. I want them to be empathetic towards others. I want them to treat people well because they care about those people and do not want to hurt them, not because they are commanded to do onto others as you would have them do onto you.
Reader Comments (29)
Talk about getting back to basics -- sounds like a fabulous foundation for a family! It's surprising how often people get sucked into "discipline" as "rules and prohibitions." Glad to see more parents raising their children to be doers, not dodgers!
I didn't see anything you mentioned that is incompatible with my Christian beliefs, nor with the beliefs of my main-stream Christian denomination (The United Church of Canada).
In fact, apart from leaving out any mention of a deity I would say you do in fact plan to raise your children with "religion" -- that is, a set of beliefs that will help guide their lives and help them be better individuals.
@Marianne - If there is room within your Christian beliefs to reject the concept of sin, then that is great (but perhaps I misunderstood you). Most definitions of religion that I have seen focus around the existence of a deity and a religious institution, so from that perspective I would certainly say we are not religious. I do plan to share my values with my children, but I also don't expect them to necessarily adopt them as their own. I expect them to develop their own values and feel free to question mine.
sounds like http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humanism.
i have no issue with religions (I prefer to believe they do more good, overall, than harm, though probably by a very fine margin...), and dogmatic beliefs actually make sense to me after substituting social history for god(s), posthumous appreciation by a social group for heaven, and posthumous resentment by a social group for hell, the latter two only affecting (and existing in) the memories and hearts of those they left behind. I too reject the notion of sin, other than a codified and disconnected set of rules to live by, handed down by previous generations with a different world view, that is too often used to judge others by, and too often a source of irrational self-criticism, neither of which is constructive. The common ground between humanism and religions is that christ was the most important jew that ever lived, but also the original humanist (his teachings were mangled by various megalomaniacs over the past 2k years (and more dangerously, by well-intentioned "academics") with the illusion of credibility.
@crammer
I would say that my world philosophy is close to humanism, but I prefer not to put any sort of constraining label on my beliefs.
Interesting post, though I do think that in order to give sin a fair assessment before "rejecting it", perhaps when your book of essays is finished, you should pick up the Bible or the Koran and read it while your kids are in the bath. Because it sounds a lot like you've read a great many doctrinal books already - on humanism, feminism, atheism, etc. I find it difficult to take your (normally well-informed and researched) post seriously due to a critical lack of understanding about what you are so vehemently denying.
A good read through of even "The Bible for Dummies" paints God as a loving parent who is setting out guidelines for His children in order to protect them, just as you are doing for your children – in fact you are modeling the Original Parent. The fruits of God’s laws; love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control (Gal 5:22) – an enviable list of attributes that any parent would be proud to see in their children.
Do I think humanity is sinful? Heck yeah – how else do we explain the shameful statistics about world poverty, while we bail out our greedy banks to the tune of $770 billion and continue in a war that is all about our lust for oil? Do I think I am sinful? Without a doubt – otherwise, my conscience would awaken me from my slothful and self-obsessed stupor and get me out there serving with my time and resources and love the people who need them. However, do I, the sinner, now self-identify as “bad people” – absolutely not – because the whole point of sin is so that we recognize the indescribable gift of forgiveness and love.
I share many of your beliefs about the limitations of religion. Your choosing to raise your children in a home that is “non-religious” is your prerogative as parents (and I absolutely agree with Marianne on this – you are, in fact rejecting one religion in favor of another). However, if your reasons for this is so that your “kids’ decisions be guided by reason, openness and love, not a closed set of values” – you are either misunderstanding or vastly underestimating parents who choose to do the opposite.
@Gill - Thank you for your comment. I have read the Bible several times. I have not read the Koran.
Couldn't have said it better myself, excellent post!
@pip: agreed - labels are generally for those who like to think in terms of "us" and "them" - probably stemming from some form of insecurity eased in part by knowing who's on their "side." If it helps them, that's fine, but weaning them from that binary world view would be even better. Then again, competition is still the best way to discover ourselves, both in victory and in defeat. Balance (rationality) is the key that too many have swallowed and forgotten.
It's interesting to read this perspective, but I can't agree with you. I don't know how you were brought up, and I'm not sure that it matters here - it just seems to me that your view of religion is dramatically one-sided. Religion is not all about sin; I view God as a father, one who looks out for me and is listening in all circumstances. To me, religion is about comfort, a greater sense of family.
Perhaps I'm thinking more along the lines of spirituality rather than doctrine - but in either case, I don't feel the heavy-handed "sin" you speak of here.
We've baptized Madeline as a Christian and will raise her as such, with the caveat that she's free to explore as she chooses. We have friends in many religions, from Islam to Christianity, as well as those who don't practice. I think that allowing her this sampling of cultures will do more good than shielding her from all such beliefs.
@bessieviola
I know that religion is not all about sin, but that is one aspect of it and it is the aspect I chose to focus on for this post. I was raised partially as a non-practicing Christian and partially as a practicing Christian (went to church/sunday school off and on in my childhood and teen years).
I don't plan to shield my children from any beliefs. In fact our school curriculum here (despite strong protest from the Catholic Church) requires teaching about a variety of different religions. However, I do plan to share my own opinion of religion with my children and let them choose their own path.
My own view on religion has become more one-sided with time. I used to think "to each his own" and that no one way was better than the other, but the more that I see people trying to mix their religion into politics and the more I see religion being a reason why people's rights are restricted or violated (as with several pieces of legislation and referendums that passed in various US states recently), the more firm I become in my stance.
I think it is great when people look to church for family and community and I think that aspect of it is wonderful. But I will seek out community and family in other places.
I really have enjoyed this post, seeing as how I intend to raise my son the same way (my step-sons have already been raised as Christians, which I would never try to undo, instead I focus on teaching them religious tolerance).
I plan to teach my son about all religions and ways of thinking about a higher power. I will explain to him that for mommy she agreed with some things in each of these religions, but not others, so I took my own values system away from that.
I am working on a post for next week about Prop 8, which is a prime example of why I won't be raising my son in any religion. Unfortunately, God in the hands of man usually results in missusing God's name to justify homophobia, racism, and all kinds of other things I consider to be very anti-Christian. Because after all, Christians are supposed to love and not judge, right?
Great post - really got me thinking!
I won't be having kids for a few years yet, but your example is so inspiring! I hope we can be as coherent and eloquent in raising our children in a secular home. I'm already saving your posts!
The religious concerns you mention, e.g. original sin and punishment, make a lot more sense if you think about the god/human relationship in terms of parent and child.
Just as in raising children, the commandments, etc, were originally instituted to found a basis of ethics and morals for people to follow. This is the heart of the matter: murder is wrong, stealing is wrong, and so on and so forth.
The key here is to recognize that the difference between right and wrong is something that needs to be taught, in many cases to those who do not understand. This is your job as a parent - to be the authority who teaches that difference.
You must enforce it, because kids don't understand, even when it's for their own good: you must take bad-tasting medicine, you must not drink detergent. You must give back toys that don't belong to you, and apologize. You cannot have ice cream for dinner.
You do love them unconditionally, but it is a mistake to let them feel that everything they do is okay. You can't be your child's friend and be supportive of everything they do, you must be willing to hold them accountable.
Else they will grow up not being able to do or accomplish anything (because they have never learned the difference between failure and success) and they will be socially maladjusted for the rest of their lives (because nothing was ever expected of them) . They will expect to be praised every time they are less than ten minutes late to work, if that's how they were raised in childhood. If, as adults, they aren't praised for doing the least expected of them, they'll be resentful and passive-aggressive because they have been taught to expect adoration at every turn.
So this is the role of the parent, and also the role of the spiritual leader - which as a parent, you are - to teach the difference between right and wrong, and lovingly guide your charges.
Children eventually grow up, learn the real reasons behind the rules they were raised with, and hopefully have earned the maturity and responsibility to make their own moral decisions. So you let them go, let them fail on their own, and grant them a level of respect. Still, this does not mean that stealing, for example, is necessarily ok.
This is where religions fail, because in many cases they are about control, not about guidance and growth and ethics.
Spiritually and morally, too, adults grow up, and need to make their own decisions. But until they know the difference between right and wrong, they must be held accountable, whether they like it or not.
To phdinparenting. I think you are missing the point. You need to be seeking out the truth instead of what you think is a good "parenting" theory, then work from there. Hopefully you also realise that just because something pushes your buttons or makes you uncomftable it dosnt mean that its neccesarily bad. Personally i believe in Jesus Christ.
I find it quite absurd that you prefer the opinion of a self confessed expert on parenting over the Bible. Which raises the question again of what is your standard or refrence point in life. Mine is the Bible. I say that God knows more than any other person and that he is good and sovreign over all things. Where as if you dont accept God's authority your a reed in the wind being blown around by which ever new theory is in fasion at the time.
Theres no denying the existance of a universal moral law. You'll find its been there ever since you can remember. A little voice saying "you know its not good to do that". Youll also agree, like me that youve disobeyed that voice asking you to do the right thing (everyone has). Where does that voice come from, i say its God.
To Lu, Just to clarify for you.
There is a difference between someone being judgemental and conviction being raised in someone. Being a Christian does not lead to hating Gay people as you suggest. I have much love for Gay people, but if someone was to ask me if what they did was wrong, i would tell them absolutely they (homosexuals) are doing the wrong thing. I would say this because its the truth, and if someone felt judged by that then its because they feel guilty about doing the wrong thing. And if i was to preach about how its wrong to live certain lifestyles such as that lived by gays, again, though taking a more active approach is ok, as i am teaching the truth of God's word in a spirit of love.
By the way it doesnt take a genius to work out that God made us male and female to "fit together", albeit within the confines of marriage. When standing before God oneday and if he were to ask why you thought its ok for people to be Gay you would be ashamed (not to mentioned scared) to hear him rebuking you. Nonetheless God loves you, thanks to Jesus Christ paying our debt.
@Ryan
The truth is a fact that can be proven. Religion and God are beliefs, not truth. The little voice saying "you know its not good to do that" comes from the morals and values passed on to me by my parents as well as other experiences that have shaped who I am, not "God". That voice tells me that it would be wrong for me to impose a religion on my children. Other people have come to other conclusions and that is fine too.
Sure males and females "fit together" (both in and outside of marriage BTW), just as legs are designed for walking, but I don't hear the church saying it is a sin to take the train instead if that is what you prefer.
I don't like religion and I'm not sure if I believe in God, but I certainly hope that if there is a God, she is not the judgmental God that you describe. If I'm wrong, so be it. I'd rather be wrong about that, then go against every conviction that I have about what is right.
well put
Came here from Sarah's site. Wow. I cannot fathom why people would come here and comment on your beliefs. This is how you live your life. I respect that. I can't understand why people want to tell you that you are wrong.
This is one of the reasons I do not follow any religion. I do not like to be told what to believe or have someone else's belief systme imposed upon me.
Great post.
It definitely appears you have put a ton of thought into your non-religion parenting philosophy. I appreciate the research and thinking time you have brought to this post.
Is the concept of sin only derived from religion, though? Because, if you do not believe in any sin AT ALL then, hmmm, things get REALLY tricky!
You mentioned:
"certainly have values that I want to pass on to my children, but I want them to understand that those are my values, those are not THE right values. Other people believe other things and value other things and that is fine."
and
"I respect everyone’s right to pass on the values that they think are important to their children. But as soon as they start saying that something is bad or sinful for everyone, versus just being wrong for their family, then I think this starts to create barriers."
If a family encourages cannibalism because it is something they value and believe is right is it still okay? If a man believes it is entirely in his own right (and has no ill-conscious or moral questioning) about molesting YOUR child, would you still think he was not sinning? Is it perfectly acceptable, just because someone was raised to not feel badly about it, to torture pets?
You say, "Other people believe other things and value other things and that is fine" and "But as soon as they start saying that something is bad or sinful for everyone," so I'm assuming that the above scenarios are OKAY with you because, if not, it would be BAD and/or SINFUL for...EVERYONE.
I'm very curious to hear your thoughts on this, especially after reading one of your latest posts on what constitutes a "bad mommy" (because, according to this post, no one can be a bad mommy--they are only being the mom they want and try to be!)
@Allie: I believe in laws, developed through democratic process, to protect everyone's well being and developed under an assumption of innocent until proven guilty. That, to me, is very different from saying that (a) everyone is a sinner and (b) there is some divine being that decides what is right and wrong.
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Hi Annie, I am a long time reader, but haven't done a lot of commenting. I just want to let you know that when I read this for the first time, years ago, I was a cradle catholic who felt guilt for everything that catholicism teaches you to feel guilty about. This blog post was a turning point for me. After reading it and doing more research/reading/youtubing, I eventually became an atheist. You shook my faith and now it is gone and I am a much better person for it. You helped me become a stronger person, and now a stronger mother. My daughter will not feel guilty or sinful for just the simple act of being born. She may believe whatever she chooses when she is old enough to do her own research, but in her youth, she will know that she is wonderful, beautiful, and good. So I am just here to thank you thank you thank you for writing this, changing my life for the better, helping me to become a better person and subsequently, helping me be a better mother.
Wow, Lacey Jane. Thank you so much for the lovely comment. :)